Beyond Imposter Syndrome

We are so quick to judge based on the surface, the external. We’re trained to choose jobs, houses and even our mates based on those surface, external metrics. It’s left us feeling isolated, as if we are not enough and needing to always do more. It’s taken a massive toll on us, both as individuals, and as a culture. 

In today’s episode, Stephanie and Maren bluntly discuss all aspects of this surface, societal leaning and don’t pull any punches. From the impacts (Getting called to the ‘Show’, Matthew Perry’s recent passing) to helpful metaphors (Houses, Native teachings) to offering solutions (Questions, Internal Structures) they are passionately all in.

This is a great episode to share with a friend who needs to know s/he is not alone.

• 06:40 Lipstick on a Pig - Changing the outer without addressing the inner
• 11:37 Alone on a Pedestal, relating to Matthew Perry
• 14:52 Beyond the Reactive Response
• 20:18 Getting called to the Show

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TRANSCRIPT

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Transcript

Maren Oslac: 0:04

In a world where achievements and accolades motivate us to do more and be more, we're often left wondering, is this really it?

Stephanie Allen: 0:12

deep inside, you know, there is more to life, you're ready to leave behind the old push your way through, and claim the deeper life that's calling you. That's where we excel. We're your hosts, Stephanie Allen,

Maren Oslac: 0:25

and Maren Oslac.

Stephanie Allen: 0:26

And this is the soulful leader podcast,

Maren Oslac: 0:29

sit back and relax as we share the shortcuts we've uncovered to help you make shift happen.

Stephanie Allen: 0:41

Hi, welcome to the Soulful leader podcast. This is Stephanie and I'm here with Maren. And we have been contemplating over the last week, a very interesting thing called, being called to the show. And I didn't ever hear that, that language before, and I didn't know what it meant. And what I'm understanding that it means is when a great athlete is called to the major leagues, or, you know, a higher level of, of athletics. And I was reflecting on it personally, of not just with athletics, but with other areas in our lives, like some things we're called up to the next level of our, our rope. And whether that's in a relationship or in business, or in health, or different things and like

Maren Oslac: 1:32

maybe a promotion,

Stephanie Allen: 1:34

exactly,

Maren Oslac: 1:35

or starting your own business,

Stephanie Allen: 1:37

starting your own business, or you win something, it could be like a, you know, a great gift that you've been given by somebody and you weren't really expecting it or something like that. And what happens is, the story goes like this, this young man was called to the show, and he fit basically the perfect, physiological, you know, checkbox to be able to go to the NBA. And he is recruited to the NBA right out of high school, but hasn't got the inner structures, the inner skill set, or the mindset, or the emotional, like all these different attributes that are needed in order to really be at that level. And those are all the interior things that nobody ever sees, right. And what had happened is, after three years of being in the NBA, which he never got to basically play, he was then let go. And I thought to myself, I'm like, Oh, my God, I could just, you know, I put myself in his shoes, and well, not really, because his shoes would be much bigger than mine. But, you know, I put myself in his shoes. And I realized that, where have I been given an opportunity or a gift, and then lost it? Like, you know, like, when they say is, you know, you don't know what you've got till it's gone. Right. I've lost it, and then realize that that was actually amazing. And now I have to work even that much harder to get back to there. So

Maren Oslac: 3:06

I hear I guess, some of the ways I, what I'm thinking about right now is, was it a gift, though? Because if he was not ready for it, and not prepared, then is it truly a gift? Or, and, we all experienced this in our lives where we're put in a situation, and in some ways, yes, it's a gift because it pushes us to grow. And in some ways, it's, it's hurtful, because I can imagine, you know, being three years, being called up because I have all the physical attributes, and nobody is taking the time to look at well, do I have all of the other attributes that you just look at being, I'm just being looked at from the outside.

Stephanie Allen: 3:57

And, isn't that true, How we look at everything so much in our culture by the outside, everything is judging it

Maren Oslac: 4:02

by the outside and then basically dismissed because my, I wasn't good enough. You're not good enough. We're gonna let you go. But you guys never even looked at who I was as as the whole being. And you've judged me and dismissed me based on one sliver, my physical attributes. Like, I think about how horrific that's just even hearing it, it feels horrific inside of me. Because mainly, because I've experienced that, you know, I know what that's like, to feel like that, to feel judged jury and executioner. Bam Because I didn't live up to some vision that you had of me, whoever the you is, and you called me to the show before I was ready or based on something that that had nothing to do with who I was. So is it a gift?

Stephanie Allen: 5:03

Yeah, I, you know, I think, no, I think Well, yes and no, I'm like,

Maren Oslac: 5:09

yes and no, right?

Stephanie Allen: 5:10

Yes and no, right. It's like, I've had situations where that's happened to me in my own life. And it's taken me another 30 years of going inside is like the deep rotor routing of the inner world, because what looks good on the outer, was empty on the internal and losing it losing the the status, or the identity, or the gift or whatever the the relationship, whatever it was on the other side. And once it was gone, then I realized I had nothing to stand on, there was nothing internally for me to fall back to rest into. And it's taken me another 30 years to work with those internal scaffolding or those internal structures inside myself. I often liken it to the house, I was just having a conversation with someone today about my home. And there, you know, I've had my home for 20 years, and I've done a lot of renovations, it's cost a lot, a lot of money, and a lot of time, a lot of effort and a lot of insight, a lot of work, trust me a lot of work. And people say, you know, is it worth it? You know, putting lipstick on a pig is often what I keep hearing, you know, like, why would put lipstick on a pig. And I'm like, you know, it's so interesting, when people are we are so quick to judge on the external. And we don't take care of the internal. So in my home, you know, I've upgraded the electrical because my house is over 100 years old, so it had knob and tube, well, 100 years old, didn't even have electrical. So when it was built, so it's like, you know, it's been upgraded, upgraded, upgraded, whether it's the plumbing, whether it's the installation, all these things that nobody ever, ever sees the benefit of, no one, but I do. Because now I can rest assured and go to bed at night and know that my electrical is going to be healthy, I've got, I've got insulation, so I know that my heating bills are gonna go down. Like there's all these other little things that I know, but no one else knows. And then all of a sudden, one day, all of a sudden, now you start to see it on the outer. Meaning if if the bones of the home aren't really solid, well, you're going to see the wear and tear on the external. It's the same as like in our own physical health, I say this over and over again, it's like, we are so quick to adjust the physical look at the physical and that doesn't say that that's important, sure is important. But if we're not looking at the emotional and mental and spiritual underpinnings of something, when you take a hit, whether it's a fall or an accident, whatever it might be, or just an emotional hit of someone else doesn't like you or you have a have a a breakup or job loss or something, we take an emotional hit mental spiritual hit, it is gonna affect our physical. Because all of those plays on it. So if we can build those internal structures with love and kindness and gentleness, and really have a daily practice, or a ritual of some sort that is always nurturing that, then we balance a little bit more, it doesn't quite shatter us. And yet the shattering like we're going back to being called the show. I can't imagine what that young man must have felt getting called up to the NBA and then saying, Oh, thanks very much, you know, thanks for coming out but you didn't make the team, off you go kind of thing. You know, here's your shirt, you know, see you later. And, you know, at a very young age going, Okay, what did I do? Like, that's, that's where I would have, what I do wrong, right? What did I do wrong? How could I be better? And it's like, you just didn't have the internal structures to be able to

Maren Oslac: 8:51

somebody put you on a pedestal before you could develop at that. So there isn't the shame that you didn't have

Stephanie Allen: 8:56

yeah, it's just realizing, it, like as this as if it was something you should have had. If anything, it Shame on the people that did that to him. And, you know, not even going there. It's

Maren Oslac: 9:11

right. Each of us has our own journey that we're on. So that young man's journey will be, part of it will be, okay, who do I need to become to own that? Whatever just happened to me. And that's actually each of our journeys, right? So if I get promoted into a job that I don't yet have the skills for external, or, more importantly, because we don't think of that we oftentimes think of the external skills like oh, I need to learn Microsoft DOS, or you know, whatever it is, I know I'm showing my age there, right? Um, but we, you know, we recognize the outer skills that we need to learn, right, the inner skills, we're not,

Stephanie Allen: 9:55

those are, we're not trained to look at them

Maren Oslac: 9:57

no

Stephanie Allen: 9:58

where can we find them?

Maren Oslac: 9:58

That's what you're talking about, like with the house is like, nobody sees that, nobody knows it, but you. And yet, it's everything. Because without a good electrical and a good plumbing system, and you know, like, everything starts to fall apart, and now you're spending all of your time, energy, effort and money just maintaining the basics. And no wonder people say, Oh, you're putting lipstick on a pig, guess what, that's what we're doing to ourselves all the time inside, because we're running around putting out electrical fires and plumbing problems and all the internal stuff, because no one's taught us. How do we maintain that and not feel like we're putting lipstick on a pig?

Stephanie Allen: 10:43

Well, and how do we develop it? How do we learn to love ourselves? How do we learn to expand our capacity to receive new information and to I mean, I hear this all the time about digital, the digital, you know, natives of this world now who can just basically do anything with apps and digital and stuff like that. And, and certain levels of generation are going, I don't even want to go there. It just stresses me out. And it's like, Well, what happened? You know, how do we keep developing? And it's I'm not talking about the skill development of it. I'm talking about how are we with ourselves through it? You know, that we start to close down and tighten up and fear the unknown, or push away help and support and love or we tell ourselves that we're, we're helpless and hopeless, you know, it's those structures that are more important than the, the skills will come. Or you'll find somebody who can totally help you. But if you do not have that internal love and care and attention and space, capacity, you will push away things, you will sabotage the very things that are trying to help you to lift you up and help broaden and expand your life and awareness.

Maren Oslac: 11:55

Yeah, I think about the people who who are almost born into greatness, and I don't say that lightly. What I mean by that is the people who we do put them on pedestals, and they are looked at, like we almost idolize them. And yet, their insides are tearing them apart and bless his heart, I'm going to bring up Matthew Perry, because he just passed away. And he was working really hard on that internal peace. And from his writings, it really sounded like he felt like he was alone in that. And I think we, we so related to him on Friends, and he entertained us and he was so masterful, and yet, there was a piece of him that couldn't even own it, that was like, I, he didn't feel worthy. And for all that we can relate to him with him in his acting, I think we can relate even more to that piece of it, where in our daily lives for all that we put on for the outer world, we still don't feel worthy, and we don't know why we're here, or what we're called to do. And I think that those are the inner structures, that we're talking about that regardless of what the outer looks like, what's going on, on the inside?

Stephanie Allen: 13:41

Yeah, and I this is why mental illness is such an epidemic right now- is that for centuries, you know, we've just been looking at the physical, and yet, it's the mental and emotional that plays out on our physical. Yeah. So really, we've taken pretty good care of the physical we I mean, we really have all the answers to be able to handle the physical now. And now

Maren Oslac: 14:05

just timeout because when I say the physical, I'm not just talking about the physical body. I mean, like, we're looking at the fact that you like people who look like they've got it all together on the physical level, like they've got the money. They've got the accolades. They've got the, you know, they've made it what you like, checked all the boxes. They were, they're in the show, they've made it.

Stephanie Allen: 14:28

They're empty, they're, they're suffering internally, right. We don't know what goes on internally, and it is hidden, it's in the darkness. And I think even in our selves we're so much like, I don't want to go in, I don't want to look at that. I don't want to bring that up. And we're so conditioned to look at the light to look at the sunshine to look at where the weather is great. And let's just go there and let's just hang out. You know, there was an interesting story. I heard the other day about and we've said, actually share this, about the Good Wolf and the Bad Wolf and You know, the Native American basically says, you know, to his, to the grandson, tells a story about the good wolf and the bad wolf. And the little, little grandson says, well, which Wolf is going to live? And we make a judgment about right, wrong, good, bad. And instead of saying, you know, and the story goes, well, it's the one you feed the one you give the attention to. And that, yes, that is definitely a practice, if you if we keep defaulting into the negative, we keep defaulting back into the trauma and the drama, kind of getting our own internal addiction hit from our internal chemicals. Sure, you don't want to keep giving attention to that, which is no longer working. And this is a both and with this, I said, you know, what we also need, I've come to a place in our society where it's not about ignoring that which isn't working anymore. It's also about leaning in, and finding a place where you can understand the person who is struggling, and going to tell me what's going on? What are you believing? Or what is happening internally? you know, when they're fully

Maren Oslac: 16:10

not to fix it

Stephanie Allen: 16:10

not to fix it, but to understand it,

Maren Oslac: 16:13

right. To listen

Stephanie Allen: 16:14

it's differend, it's still Yeah, and to come closer to that. It's like, if you look at bullies, and you see this a lot in the school system, you know, we have to, you know, end bullying or stamp out bullying, and I'm like, well, that's bullying the bully, isn't it? It's like, what do we understand why the bully is even bullied? Like, is there a need? Is there something that's happening? and that, that takes incredible amount of compassion. And we cannot, you know, there's an old spiritual saying that says, you know, you cannot pray for peace, if you are have not looked at getting peace inside yourself, if you have not worked within it within yourself, it's really hard to offer something that you have not cultivated within yourself. Well, that is the same with you know, the good wolf, bad wolf, or the bullying, it's like, if we haven't looked at the darkness inside ourselves with love and compassion and gentleness and kindness, you're not going to look at it and someone else with the same, we're going to try to burn, cut, poison and annihilate, which is where we tend to always default in our world is like, like, just blow it up, like, get rid of it, you know. Whether it's medical, whether it's war, whether it's whatever it is, we just, we tend to take a very much reactive response to it, rather than being with it, being with the uncomfortability. Hmm, you know, that Maren, and she's having a hard time and wonder, you know, she's really getting Prickly, I wonder what's really going underneath it, we take it personally. So it's then, let me, because I care about this person, I'm going to hold space for them and just lean and say, what's happening? what's going on internally? Because a lot of times we don't know how to go in. We're so on the hot messiness that we don't know how to drop in. And this is why we collectively really do need communities, we really need each other. It isn't about get, look, if we could get you know, gotten it out of a book or out of a movie or out of a something online, we would have already we have all the information we need. This is why we need to come into relationship and why co creating together is, is what's going to have to happen for us to move to a whole new paradigm.

Maren Oslac: 18:29

And when I think about that, I go back to kind of what we started with of instead of judging the, you know, like the being called to the show, when we look at ourselves, and instead of judging it, as I'm ready, I'm not ready. What's the conversation that needs to happen? On an internal level of yeah, there may be skills outwardly that I need to develop and also, what am I being called to inwardly to develop more compassion, more understanding, more presence, the ability to listen at a deeper level, there are so many you know, I think that we call them soft skills, and they're so important. The hard skills Yeah, they're important and the Scott soft skills are like the key. They're the internal like you said, the, the stuff that's behind what you see in your house, those are the things that are behind what we see on the outer, and they change our experience of our own lives, so that I get to be in my life, and celebrating an exciting and, and loving my life instead of in that constant doubt and shame and fear that I think a lot of people live in. That our society encourages to live in with all the ads of you should be this and you should be that and right,

Stephanie Allen: 20:08

you know, the world is set up to distract us from looking any further underneath the surface, like let's just look at the topical level.

Maren Oslac: 20:18

Yeah. So my wish for all of you is that you get called to the show, so that you have a chance to stop and look around and say, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a minute, what needs to happen in here, for me to really own that,

Stephanie Allen: 20:37

and I want to say, you know, not getting called to the show, and then having you know, losing something that you didn't even know was great until it's gone, can also be a great journey. Or, you know, I could save my 30 years of being called the show, and then losing it has actually helped me go underneath the surface. And now standing in the future of that 30 year journey, I, during the journey wasn't so obviously fun. But getting to through 30 years of it and looking back on Wow, I've really changed, I've really evolved it, it has been a thread that has helped me see a bigger picture. And if I hadn't had that, I often say, you know, if you hadn't had the difficulty or the challenge or the thing in your life, you may not have ever dug underneath the surface. And, you know, I've met many people who have never dug underneath the surface and their lives, when they come to me, their lives are so empty, and there's even more, the sooner you can dig and go underneath the surface, the more joy the more I mean, that's where treasure is right? The more treasure you're going to find the more joy everything. The longer you wait, the harder or at least it's not true. It's not harder to go in there. It's just that your mind thinks it's harder. And so the mind becomes more rigid. Yeah, more rigid, and the emotions are more attached to who you think you are.

Maren Oslac: 22:07

It's like you're right, the deeper the groove goes in, for those of you who are old enough to remember records, right? You get stuck in a groove, right? And it's harder to get out, or at least the impression is that it is hard,

Stephanie Allen: 22:24

right? And you know, what is difference between a groove and gra, and a grave? Six feet. Right. So if you keep digging out that groove, you're gonna dig yourself a grave, and then you're The Walking Dead. And I think, you know, there's parts of myself that are still the Walking Dead. And I know that when I hit up against an uncomfortability, or difficult, I know this is an opportunity to go in and get the buried treasure. And this is when not to shame yourself or to beat yourself up wrong, but say, Okay, now this is time to ask for help. This is time to actually come into relationship with a community that that is growing and evolving. And it's time to learn some skills and the soft skills and the internal. Yeah.

Maren Oslac: 23:10

As we're headed towards the culmination of the year, I think a lot of people do take this time of year to stop and reflect. So as you're doing that, check in, I would love to, we would love to hear from you as far as what are some of the things that you're looking at for this coming year, on an internal level? of what things that the skills that you want to develop so that when you are called to the show, whatever that show may be for you, that you feel a little more prepared on the internal, inside here? So we'd love to hear from you. Remember, you can find us at the soulful leader on both Facebook and LinkedIn, and now on YouTube. And for anybody that is interested. Remember that, or maybe you don't know yet, that we have all next year, we're going to be working with a small group of people. And if you would like to be one of those people in our community, reach out to us. You can find more information at the soulful leader podcast.com or on our new website. It's TSLP dot life and it stands for the soulful leader project TSLP and it's dot life. So we'll see you all next week on the soulful leader podcast.

Stephanie Allen: 24:40

And that wraps up another episode of the soulful leader Podcast with your hosts Stephanie Allen

Maren Oslac: 24:46

and Maren Oslac. Thank you for listening. If you'd like to dive deeper, head over to our website at the soulful leader podcast.com.

Stephanie Allen: 24:57

Until next time,