Beyond Figuring It Out

You are not the problem.  
The way you were taught to solve problems is actually limiting you. 

Rational thinking is inherently limited - mainly because we’re not meant to stop at ‘rational’, we are meant to keep evolving. 

Einstein said that you cannot solve that problem on the same level that created it. That means traditional problem-solving methods are insufficient for addressing our modern societal issues and personal challenges.

It's time for us to go beyond what we currently know and do, we need to develop ‘trans-rational’ awareness. Trans-rational awareness is real, and embracing it requires each of us to let go of who we think we are.

That may seem confusing and scary, and there is a process. 

This week, Stephanie and Maren: 

• break down this cutting edge subject 
• talk about why ‘figuring’ has left us in a bind
• share options for how to move to the next level
• use migraines as an example
• introduce two upcoming programs that build skill with transrational tools
• share the answer to the question so many hold in their hearts - “Why bother?”  

If you are frustrated with escalating issues in your own life and the world, there is a better way. Today's podcast does more than scratch the surface - it provides tangible tools to foster deeper, more meaningful and impactful lives. It provides hope.

• 01:00 If you could have figured it out, you would have already
• 03:50 Beyond the figuring; trans-rational
• 07:57 The role of meditation
• 11:29 Why bother? For you and the world
• 13:38 There is another way, breadcrumbs and science
• 17:55 Where do I begin? Presencing life.
• 23:54 Pig Latin

LINKS

16:40 Sir Ken Robinson TedX Talk

TRANSCRIPT

YouTube Video

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Transcript

Stephanie Allen: 0:04

In a world where we have everything and it's still not enough, we're often left wondering, is this really it?

Maren Oslac: 0:10

Deep inside you know, there's more to life. You are ready to leave behind the old push your way through and claim the deeper, more meaningful life that's calling you.

Stephanie Allen: 0:19

That's what we invite you to explore with us. We're your hosts, Stephanie Allen and

Maren Oslac: 0:24

Maren Oslac, and this is The Soulful Leader Podcast.

Stephanie Allen: 0:30

Yay! Hi! Welcome to The Soulful Leader Podcast. This is Stephanie, and I'm here with Maren, and I'm trying to figure things out. You ever feel like that? You ever feel like in your life, you are just like, I can't figure this out. I need help. I'm puzzled.

Maren Oslac: 0:45

If I could just figure this out, if I could just figure that one thing out, right?

Stephanie Allen: 0:50

Or, you know, why does this hurt? If I could just figure out why this hurts, I'd stop doing that.

Maren Oslac: 0:56

If I could just figure out how to make enough money, then I'd be good.

Stephanie Allen: 1:03

or have enough time.

Maren Oslac: 1:04

I love the ones that are... if I could just figure out how to make that person like me.

Stephanie Allen: 1:11

Like what am I doing wrong? We default to this thing. And I guess, you know, we're talking about the figuring it out. Because if you know, if you could have figured it out, you would have already,

Maren Oslac: 1:22

Yeah, we're smart people.

Stephanie Allen: 1:24

Yeah, we're in the future of our past.

Maren Oslac: 1:26

Okay! Wait a minute...

Stephanie Allen: 1:29

Well, we are, you know, it's like, the hindsight is 20/ 20, right? You look back in your time, it's like, Oh, my God, if I knew now, you know, and then, and take that back into my past, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have done X, Y or Z.

Maren Oslac: 1:43

So that's what you mean. You're in the future of your past. Look back and look at your past, right?

Stephanie Allen: 1:50

Right, and I can look back and see myself in my past and going, yeah, but if I could have figured it out, you know, I would have. And sometimes things show up for us that are seemingly just not rational, like, how did this happen? You know, we might call them coincidences, or we might call them synchronicities or serendipity, or all these different things. But what if you know, because it alludes our figuring it out mind, so what's really happening? What's really going on? I used to struggle a lot with migraines... alot. I would have a migraine every, pretty much every week, and I would be out for a day. And I always say, you know, if you ever had the experience of migraines, and they're really, really horrific, you have one full horrific day, or two full horrific days, and then once you start to come out of that migraine, then you have a day of hangover of just like, man, I'm just wiped out. And I relate that to the figuring it out. I used to have this visual of, like, you know, those little gnomes that they put on the front lawns. And I always felt like someone had just pile driven me into the ground, and I was stuck and all I could have was my little head was sticking out, and I was like... oh my God, if I could just figure out how to get out of this bind. And I really, truly believe that that is what migraines, or at least that's what mine were. It was brain confusion, like I was kind of stuck in it, in the ground, or in the muck and the mire, and my head was trying to figure it out, to get out of it, and it couldn't. And so I would beat myself up about it. I would be really hard on myself. We're talking about this because I think we're at a place in humanity where there's a lot of social systems and a lot of things that are crashing and burning and not going the way that we thought they would go. We might feel like we're out of control, and we're trying to figure out a new way.

Maren Oslac: 3:50

So I'm gonna, you know, kind of pause you there, because one of the things that both you and I are aware of and that we want to share is that there is something beyond figuring it out. Yes, which may seem really strange, because our current culture epitomizes rational and rationality. When I say it epitomizes it, it's like, that's the top of the totem pole when you've gotten to that high, rational achiever place, you've arrived, right? And I can appreciate that, because it traditionally, if you're not rational, you're irrational. And we all know what it's like to deal with somebody who's irrational, including ourselves, right? So what we're bringing to the table today is something that is considered'transrational' When I talk to people about this, I tell them that there are many, many smarter people than I am out there who have shown that as human beings, our evolution is not, and does not end at high rational, at this rational place. That there's something, there are actually many layers beyond it. So if for those of you are like, hmm... you can go look up somebody named Ken Wilber or Claire Graves, and they have some beautiful systems that they have done a lot of work on showing that there are stages beyond this rational thinking that are transrational. So when I say beyond the rational thinking, it's not letting go of the rational thinking and becoming irrational. It's to transcend and include. So it's understanding. In having that, you have to get to that rational place, and then there's something beyond it. Before we came on, you had mentioned the quote....Einstein?

Stephanie Allen: 6:03

Yeah, so Einstein would say, you know, when we create a problem, you cannot solve that problem on the same level that created that problem. You have to transcend it. You have to go to a higher level of thinking or being or understand awareness, understanding you need to transcend that. It's like being on the ground level of something, and you can't really see the big picture until you go up a few floors, or you get in a helicopter or an airplane, and you look at it from a higher view, then you can see, oh, that's where the traffic's all getting clogged up. I get it. This is what's needed. But we can't stay on the ground and make changes in that. We have to let go. I have another saying. You can't steal second base with your foot on first you have to let go of where you're at now. You have to step out and into the unknown if you want to, to transcend and include where we are. I mean, there's just so many things that we could start. And as a therapist, I'm pretty darn sure... I haven't really done, you know, experiments in this. But this is my own personal experience of 30 years of doing this is and even with myself, that when there is pain or suffering in one's body or in one's mind or heart or soul, it's often because we're on an edge. We literally have reached the pinnacle of that rational and we now need to transcend it. We need to go to a new place to have a look at it from a different place.

Maren Oslac: 7:34

That's what you're talking about with your headaches, like you're butting up against that edge of... you know, in society, society says, well... figure that out...use your head, you know, do all the rational stuff. And there was something that was calling you to a higher level of awareness, the transrational, like, what's beyond the rational? And there actually is something beyond it. Imagine that?

Stephanie Allen: 7:57

Imagine that. And I think, as a culture, what we think is that's what meditation is. Like, we're supposed to just sit there and figure it out. But that's not meditation. And I think when people say, well, I can't I meditate. I can't sit still, my mind's going crazy. It's going all over this place, you know. And it's like, yeah, that's the rational. That's the rational that you are now transcending by being aware of it, if that makes some sort of sense, but it's like where you're not sitting there trying to figure something out, you actually are sitting there being present to the mind, the monkey mind, going everywhere and witnessing it, but not attaching to it. And those are hard concepts to really, to really, you know...

Maren Oslac: 8:43

...so this may help. I think of meditation as a tool to allow me to quiet that rational mind that wants to talk about everything and figure everything out and that I've given so much power to that I'm like, all right, you're in charge, because you're the highest level that I've ever achieved, right? And so if I want to go beyond that, I can use a tool like meditation to help me to be present to, like you said, what's beyond that. So now this is the word you just used, the witness of like, there's a part of you when, when you notice that your mind won't shut up...who's the you that noticed that?

Stephanie Allen: 9:31

Oh, that's brilliant. Exactly. Who is that Who is that? (laughter) Who is that you that is seeing out? you? This is what Rumi says...who sees with my eyes or speaks with words with my mouth or hears with my ears? Like, who is that, right? Yeah, who just said that or just said that. Did I say that out loud? You know? Like, well, who was that? There's all these parts of us, and I think it's fascinating, because I think the hardest part of transrationalizing (that's what it is.) But like, you know, to basically to, I want to say, let go of figuring it out, almost like unlearning it, right?

Maren Oslac: 10:15

You know, we do need to let it go. And when I say, let it go. So I'm going to use a simple example. We learned, you know, addition and subtraction, and then we let that go because we knew it. And we learned multiplication and division. We didn't lose addition and subtraction because we let it go. We already know it. You know how to be rational, and starting to understand that's just a part of who you are. There IS a time and place for it. And then when you let that go to develop the skills and this other part of you, then you learn where the rational fits. Because right now, it's everything.

Stephanie Allen: 11:01

And there is a time and place for it. When I think it's letting go of the attachment to it, the identity right, of saying that is just who I am, and I feel like that might be the part that people struggle with in meditation, is that they are going to have to let go of that identity of the rational so that they can step out of that and it'll allow themselves to be a witness to what wants to happen.

Maren Oslac: 11:29

So let me ask you this, if somebody is able to do that, why? What's the benefit? Why bother?

Stephanie Allen: 11:37

That is such a great question. Well, I'm gonna go right back to the migraines that I had, right? Like, I'm sorry, but if anybody's ever had migraines, like, don't you want to, like, let that shit go? Like, seriously, right? It's so painful, and I'm using that because I have experience with

Maren Oslac: 11:53

Because you haven't been there yet. It takes me back that, with myself. But there's other things that are painful, whether it's, you know, difficult relationships or financial problems, or just constantly reacting to traffic, or, like being reactive to all kinds of things that are coming up. It's like, what would life be like if you didn't react. That you didn't come up against an obstacle and try to force your way through it? What if you what if you had another option? That's what I'm meaning about transrational. Because the rational was, use your head just barrel through and get it done and make it happen, you're not doing enough, all those things. If you could actually have another option, what would that be like for you and to know that the other option actually not only will take you to the place that you want to go, but actually to a place that's even better, that you can't even imagine because you haven't been there yet. to the Einstein quote and our world, the world that we're in right now, which has so many issues and so many problems, and they seem like they're getting worse and worse. It is asking us to step up and beyond, because the problems that we've created have come from our rational thinking, our rational minds, and we're brilliant, and if we could have figured it out, we would have. And so it's almost like the world itself is asking us to step up and do go to the next level, because if we don't, we're going to stay in the same, you know, muck and mire that we're in right now, and it's pretty crappy.

Stephanie Allen: 13:38

And not only is it crappy for ourselves is that, you know, we tend to pull other people into it. So that's that old saying of hurt people hurt people. We don't do it intentionally, but we're hurting ourselves, and we don't realize that hurting ourselves is also hurting those that we love and around us and the planet... all those different levels. And so what if there was another way? And there is and what would it require within me is to let go of who I think I am, so that I can become who I'm meant to become. Because there is something like I said before... I am the future of my past. Well, there is a future of me. I'm in the past of my future right now too. There is a future calling me, and hopefully...hopefully, I am tuning into a future that is much more beautiful and evolved than the one I'm at now. And not to say that the one I'm at now isn't great, but I feel like as an evolution of a human being is that we're meant to keep transcending where we're at, not from a high, rational achiever kind of thing of like, goal setting, and got to have this, and got to have that, not consumerism. I'm not talking about that. It's just that we become more refined. We become more deep, more deeper. We become, you know, more refined and more beautiful inside. That's my dream, or my vision for that and I I know there's a future Stephanie out there that is actually probably leaving me breadcrumbs, like Hansel and Gretel, of the fairy tale that's leaving me little, AHA's along the way, and I need to find a way. So when you said what's the other benefit of having a practice, whether it's meditation or whatever your practices are, to be able to still one's mind, to let go of who you think you are, it's so that you can, you can capture those little breadcrumbs, because those breadcrumbs are going to lead you to a magical, mystical, wonderful world that lifts you up, which empowers you to lift others from that place too. Because we don't walk on these paths alone.

Maren Oslac: 15:45

We don't and I'm going to bring science into this, because oftentimes when we hear that, that magical world and right, it becomes kind of WooWoo. And the cool thing about Woo is that science is backing it up. So when we're talking about that, there's something beyond the rational, quantum physics is showing that everything exists all at once, past, present and future. Well, that's not rational, right?

Stephanie Allen: 16:18

Yeah..that my brain can't even capture that.

Maren Oslac: 16:24

Correct. And the fact that we have the same cells in our brain, we have some of those exact same cells, both in our heart and in our gut, there's a reason for that. We're not meant to...there's a great sir Ken Robinson that has got a great YouTube video where he talks about the epitome of life is the professor, because, but they walk around and they're everything is their heads are everything is up and to the left because their heads are so heavy, because they've worked so hard on following their brains on the left side. On the left side, that's the rational right. And while I said, like I said, it's important, it's not everything though, we are full bodied human beings. We have bodies. We have a right side. And like I said, the cells, there are cells, the cells that exist in our brain that are our thinking cells. We have exactly the same cells also in our hearts, in our guts. And so again, we're looking at science that is showing us that we don't actually live in a rational world. It's transrational. So it's our duty. I feel like it's our duty to, for those of us that can even grasp this, it's our duty to step up and go, okay, I don't really understand it and what it means, and how do I go there?

Stephanie Allen: 17:55

Where do I begin? Where do I begin?

Maren Oslac: 17:59

And so for those of you that are listening, we have we actually do this. We've got a 12 days of Christmas that we do, which is an ancient mystical practice. Our teacher, Daniel Goodenough had introduced us to it probably 20 years ago or more, and we do it every year. And so it's presencing the future that wants to happen, because each of the 12 days of Christmas relates to a month of the following year. And so you're actually being present, and you're going completely transrational here, because this is not like you can't figure out what's going to happen in January, February, March, April. You can set goals.

Stephanie Allen: 18:42

It's playful. It's playful. The right side of our brain is actually the creative side. And just like Sir Ken Robinson, most of the education system doesn't develop the right side of the brain. It's working primarily on the left side, the logical, linear part of the world, the doer, instead of the receptive part of being able to presence those breadcrumbs to Hansel and Gretel... like to home. So what if there was a way... which there has been a mystical practice of the 12 Days of Christmas that we are actually going to call the 12 days of presence, and whether you spell it with a -T or an -ENCE, it's up to you. It's the 12 days of presence to allow you to really capture what wants to happen, what your future self has laid down as possibilities in your upcoming year. And it's delightful and fun and playful. And I know the first time I did it like Maren has been saying, we've probably been doing this for close to 20 years, it's taken me a long time to do the 12 days, because I don't know about you, but I have not really been encouraged to play. And so it's like a muscle that needs to be developed. And so I find it such a beautiful way to learn how to develop that playful joyful, creative part of yourself.

Maren Oslac: 20:02

Yeah, that's so true. I'm just kind of struck by that I hadn't thought about it from the playful part and how much we "should" ourselves, you know, I mean, because both you and I have talked about this in the past, where, you know, for the first few years, we would do a couple of days, or maybe get through six days and not do the rest of them. And there's that, oh, I should have, and we would should on ourselves. And I hadn't actually considered it from a place of that I hadn't developed the muscle of being playful, of allowing myself to just explore and be imaginary and say, hmm, I don't know, what did I notice today?

Stephanie Allen: 20:43

That's so cool. And for those of you who are kind of at that age of considering retirement, which, whatever that might mean to you. But I think of what, traditionally, what many people are thinking of retirements like.. okay, I've worked for, you know, 25- 30 years. It's time for me to play now and enjoy my life. And I have a different presencing of that of like, what if your life could be playful no matter what, whether you're at work or at home, there's not that separation and that when you are ready to transcend your work life that you have already have built that muscle to really be receptive, to be playful and joyful with your life and those you love. And to me, that's what this practice is.

Maren Oslac: 21:29

And one of the things that we started last year, and when it went over really well, was that we did a year long mastermind that took the presencing that we did through those 12 because, I mean, it's new material. It's kind of outside the box. It's it's not just kind of outside of it is.

Stephanie Allen: 21:52

It is outside the box, right? And it's going to stretch your right brain.

Maren Oslac: 21:56

It stretches your right brain...

Stephanie Allen: 21:58

in a safe and playful way.

Maren Oslac: 22:01

So we work with that throughout the entire year. So we've got a 2025, mastermind. It is open now. It's called the co creation circle, because we're literally co-creating our lives with life itself, which is a really, again, outside the box concept. And if you're one of those people that's ready...that's like, I don't know what that means, and that's interesting. Like, what I find for myself is my body leans in. I'm like, oh, I've leaned in. Why have I leaned in? I don't know, because my brain doesn't get it. I've started to learn to trust my body. Of like, oh, I've leaned in. There's something there for me. If there's something there for you. Give us a contact. You know, call us or find us on Facebook or LinkedIn or whatever, and, you know, ask us about it. Let's get on a call and we'll talk about it.

Stephanie Allen: 22:49

Yeah, and if you want to have more joy and play in your life and you need some help to give yourself permission to do so, the co-creation circle is totally that and it will uplift you. And I love playing with other people who are on that same kind of outside of that box wavelength is that it's a safe place.

Maren Oslac: 23:08

It's a totally different way of transforming your life and doing, you know, the whole new year's resolutions and goal setting and blah blah blah of that stuff that we're so tired of. If you're tired of it and you really do want to change things, I invite you to join us. You can find information about it, because I know there are people are like, okay, you've talked about it. How do I find information on it? It's on our website www.tslp.life which stands for The Soulful Leader Project, because we stand for life. Or you can just contact us, poke at us, we always like to hear from you guys.

Stephanie Allen: 23:48

You can let figuring go and welcome play in. So one of the new things that we are doing now is that we are inviting you all to ask us questions that we are going to integrate into our podcast. So I know I've talked to a few of you out there that have had some really good insights for me to say, hey, I really loved what you talked about, but I don't quite understand this. Or can you say this another different way, so that I can, I can apply it in my life, and I love those things. So what Maren and I are talking about doing now, and what we're going to be doing moving forward, is that when you send us the questions, we are actually going to put those into a lovely newsletter with like kind of questions and answers and practices and and little delight things for you all to deepen what we have just talked about, so that you really, really feel like you are connected because you are. You're so connected to us and we want to help and serve in the best possible ways that you can, you can understand as we realize that sometimes, you know, Maren and I get talking into our own language, and yeah, you know, it's like when you were a kid and you had Pig Latin, right? Sometimes it can sound like pig latin and so we would love to be able to talk your language too. So please tell us what that is, and we'd be delighted to unpack it with you.

Maren Oslac: 25:12

Yeah. So if you have a question, like, as you were listening to this podcast and you thought, what does that mean? Or you were going to go look something up on Google, go look it up, and also poke at us about it, because if you have the question, somebody else does too... excellent! So we'll talk to you guys all in two weeks and make sure that you're on our email list, so that you get our email in between the podcasts. Thanks for listening.

Stephanie Allen: 25:48

And that wraps up another episode of The Soulful Leader Podcast with your hosts, Stephanie Allen

Maren Oslac: 25:53

and Maren Oslac. Thank you for listening. If you'd like to dive deeper, head over to our website, at The Soulful Leader Podcast.com

Stephanie Allen: 26:05

Until next time...