The Soulful Leader Podcast
The Soulful Leader Podcast
You’re Not Lost—You’re Being Called
Purpose. Meaning. Clarity.
Do you ever feel like you’re chasing these in your life and just as you reach them, they, poof, slip through your fingers?
You’re not alone.
In this episode, Stephanie and Maren unpack what it really means to pursue this power trio — not as a destination, but as a living, breathing practice.
Society treats them as boxes to tick, and that’s part of the problem. Today’s episode explores going beyond what you’ve been taught to a deeper kind of listening, into the path of inner mastery.
Being in conscious relationship with yourself, your mission, and the larger world around you is the road less traveled. It’s not easy, and it may be exactly what’s calling you - as it is for so many of the high achieving leaders that work with Maren & Stephanie.
Here’s a question to ponder -
👉 Do you know the difference between purpose and mission?
Spoiler: One tends to come from ego. The other? It whispers from the soul.
In addition this, they also explore:
- Why clarity is not a one-time achievement but an evolving, sacred process
- How to tell if your “purpose” is actually ego-driven
- The real meaning of mission—and how it emerges through both joy and hardship
- Why leaders who seek depth must get comfortable with not knowing
- The trap of cultural quick-fixes—and how to trade those for sustainable inner practice
- How collaboration (not competition) is the soil where your mission grows
- The truth about being “all alone” vs. “all one”—and what that means for your leadership
If you’ve ever hit a wall, lost your way, or questioned everything just when you thought you had it figured out—this episode is for you.
Clarity doesn’t come from efforting harder. It comes from slowing down, tuning in, and being willing to walk the long arc of becoming.
🔔 What’s Next?
Go deeper with the Inner Mastery Series. This is where the ideas Stephanie and Maren talk about come alive—in practice, in community, and in you.
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🔗 Links & Resources
- Join the Inner Mastery Class → www.TSLP.life/2360-2/
- Connect on LinkedIn, Facebook, and YouTube
- Subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode
- Dive deeper at The Soulful Leader Project → www.TSLP.life
Chapter Markers
0:32 Clarity- a tenant of inner mastery
5:19 Transforming your life, mission vs purpose
9:25 There’s a practice to it
13:09 Avoidance and healing
17:07 Achiever brain
19:22 You are a part of something even bigger
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In a world where we have everything and it's still not enough, we're often left wondering, is this really it?
Maren Oslac:Deep inside you know, there's more to life you're ready to leave behind the old push your way through and claim the deeper, more meaningful life that's calling you.
Stephanie Allen:That's what we invite you to explore with us. We're your hosts, Stephanie Allen and
Maren Oslac:Maren Oslac, and this is The Soulful Leader Podcast.
Stephanie Allen:Yay! Hi. Welcome to The Soulful Leader Podcast, and I'm here with Maren and super excited about talking about clarity. First of all, what even is clarity, and why are we seeking it so much, you know? And what happens when we're not clear?
Maren Oslac:And just if you've been listening into our series last week, we started talking about, actually, two weeks ago, three weeks ago, whatever it was, a couple of podcasts ago, we started talking about inner mastery, and clarity is one of the tenants of inner mastery. So we really wanted to go into what is clarity and why is it important to to being masterful on the interior. And if you've missed those podcasts we started with, I think it was episode 183 which was What is Inner Mastery. And then we had episode 184 where we talked about emotional regulation. So today we're digging further in and going into clarity.
Stephanie Allen:Yeah, clarity of purpose is, is interesting word too, like thinking of the word... well, clarity and purpose. I have witnessed so much, even in myself. It's like, dang, I just want to know, like, can I just figure this out? Can I just have the answer and then I'll be set for life? You know? I'll just kind of go on my little path and work with that focus and clarity. But the thing is, is that it isn't a one and done, and I think it's really important to say that.
Maren Oslac:I think it is too because I think that we're trained as a culture right now in this like... Oh, I got it, I got it. I got that. I understand that, you know, I look at so many classes and I know you these things drive you nuts, the three steps to clarity of purpose...
Stephanie Allen:Right?
Maren Oslac:Right? Change your entire business model in 10 easy steps?
Stephanie Allen:Yeah, I think of it like, you know, if I'm cooking and I have a recipe and there's, like, you know, so many ingredients and has to be put in this order, and has to be... which is great if you're baking a cake, if you're making something and even then, I you know, you can add a little extra spice, you can take a little bit away some sugar, and, you know, there's a lot of things that we can change and make different. But when we talk about mastery, we really need that... the map
Maren Oslac:Yeah, so when you're talking about that, cycle...when we go back to clarity of purpose or clarity in is inside all of us, and there isn't a one and done. There our lives, I think we do get caught in this, 'If I could just isn't just one map that one size fits all. It's not and even your find clarity, everything else would be okay.' And I actually kind of agree with that statement, and I also have a own personal map is going to have changes and rerouting. You problem with it, and so I'll start with the agree part I agree with the statement is because I do think that the lack know, that's what makes the adventure really cool. That's of clarity causes a lot of problems in our lives. And the challenge that I have with that statement is that clarity is why it called a quest. And the quest is a question. It's not an a... it's not what we're actually seeking. I know that sounds strange, so it's it's the intermediary type of thing. It's answer. It's like for me, how do we ask better questions so that when I look at clarity, clarity about what? There's something it will lead us on the quest for more clarity? But, and to behind the clarity. And I think that's one of the things we wanted to get to in relationship to inner mastery, because we can continue asking questions, there isn't like a game, there's a have clarity of purpose. Okay, my purpose is to get up and get start and a finish. It's an ever evolving process, and to have some food because I'm hungry, I'm pretty clear that I'm hungry and I need food. And, you know, I got my clarity. That doesn't joy in that process. help with my big life, like, like, the bigger life, like, oh, I have angst in my life.
Stephanie Allen:Yeah, coming from the questions of, who am I? Yeah...we tend to use that...those words kind Why am I here? What is the purpose or meaning of my life?
Maren Oslac:Yes, and that's where, when we have clarity around those things, we can transform our lives and from a place of joy and inspiration, which is what you and I are all about. You know, many people are helping with, once you're whacked upside the head or, you know, you're in drama and trauma, how do you how... do you move out of that? One of the things that you and I are standing for is you don't have to actually get whacked upside the head or go into drama and trauma, and we can, we can transform our lives, and the path to that is beyond clarity of purpose, I think it's clarity of mission. So I love when you talk about the difference between purpose and mission. You want to share that with us? of simultaneous, like, you know, meaning......interchangeably.
Stephanie Allen:Yeah, but they're definitely not. Like, when you think of a purpose, this is my perspective, anyway, is that when I think of purpose, it's coming from me, myself, and I... the ego, like I want this or I'm seeking that. So it's like...
Maren Oslac:...it could be an organization. When you say, 'I'...it could be a group organization is their purpose is, and it's set by them, by the ego, right?
Stephanie Allen:So when you're looking at it's like, you know, you're telling the universe what you want or what the group wants, and there's not a lot of space to actually listen. You're just kind of putting it out there and then creating the map or the plan to make that happen, versus going, hmm, what does my soul or spirit or the universe, whatever language you use, want to have happen? So it's, it's in relationship. I look at it as a relationship. It's it's not about me always having my way or you always having your way. It's, what is the... what is the US? What is the unity aspect and meaning from a deeper place of our souls, an agreement.
Maren Oslac:In the past, you used a word in relationship to mission of it's a calling. Yeah, it's a calling. It's like, it's almost like, when you when you feel called by something, and you do all of the other stuff, there's still a lack of fulfillment, because you, you haven't moved towards that calling. And I think that a lot of people can actually really relate to that, especially in today's day and age, where we're so distracted we're being pulled in lots of direct, different directions. Here's a simple example of like, I start my day with really great intentions of doing the things that I know will move the needle and really being present to that listening of I'm in the conversation with what wants to happen, the future that wants to happen, and then I get distracted, and I do this thing over here, and I do that thing over there, and this person needs something and and I stop listening in the middle of my day to know, are those in alignment with where I'm really meant to be for that day, what I've asked for, what I'm in that conversation with, with the calling, right, that that deeper calling. And at the end of my day, I realized, like... Oh, I got really distracted. And so it's not a good, bad, a great, wrong. It's an awareness, and this is taking us to the Inner Mastery. I think most of the time, we'll go into shame around that when we get to that place, whether it's at the end of the day or the end of a project or the end of a whatever, and we realize that's not quite the way like I envisioned, that it would be, or that it doesn't really feed my soul, and then we shame ourselves. So that inner mastery is that ongoing conversation of, oh, that's interesting, the quest that you're talking about, oh, that's interesting, where does that...so what's next for me? -If I'm in this conversation with life, the universe, the one who sent you, your soul, whatever you want to call that.
Stephanie Allen:So it's interesting, because I think we're told, we're conditioned mostly to have answers and to take action like we're basically judged and by performance, by what we do in this outer world. And we can be still listening, and it would look, might look like procrastination or lack of self confidence, when really it's sitting in the question, sitting in the not knowing, with faith of like, okay, there is a reason I'm here. There's a reason this is, this is a stumbling block, not that it's from a right or wrong or good or bad reason, but that it may be slowing us down for a reason, or it may be having us really be present to what is being called of us. So coming back to that calling, you know, our teacher Daniel Goodenough. part of the HuPerson Project, and it talks about life mission that it is, it's already embedded in our DNA, our reason for being here, and it's buried. And sometimes there are times in our life that there's pain and suffering, which helps to unveil some of those deeper gifts and strengths, but sometimes there's also joy and inspiration, which also helps to unveil and I love that Daniel talks about our mission is actually... we do need to choose. That's where our free will comes from, is to be able to choose from... do you want it through pain and suffering, or would you like it through joy and inspiration? And there needs to be a practice of looking within so that one can create a space to actually receive the guidance, to receive the next step. And it doesn't just happen. I mean, it might. It's like, you know, when someone meditates and they go, I had the best meditation forever. It was so great. I would just, like, reach such great inner peace. Like, yeah, that's most of the time...that's a fluke. I mean if you really don't...
Maren Oslac:...if they don't have a regular practice...
Stephanie Allen:yeah, and even if you have a regular practice like that's pretty rare. You gotta work it. And so what I'm saying is that our purpose is saying that, not to say that our purpose doesn't have work in it, but our purpose is something that our ego, or the group ego, decides what they're going... what we're up to. But the mission is how you're actually being called, and that requires deep listening and preparation on the inner. Both of them require work and practices. They tend to just do the purpose thing and not really being open to... because a mission like you think, if somebody gives you like I think of Mission Impossible with Tom Cruise, right? You know, you get, you know, are you ready to accept this mission? And it's always going to put you outside of your comfort zone. It is going to challenge you, and it may not even be something that you go, oh, damn. Like, I don't even want to do that. Like that's gonna require a whole lot of changes in my mind, inmy way of behaving, in my in my emotions. That's going to... and so does purpose too. But there's something that you know you're being chosen for.
Maren Oslac:Well, I think sometimes, I think sometimes we get caught up in purpose so that we stay busy and we don't actually have to look at the deeper mission, because if we stay busy, then it keeps the inner voice at bay most of the time, the inner voice that's saying, you know, there's more. You know, there's more. And then when we get quiet and still, we are uncomfortable, because then we hear that voice that says, you know, there's more, and we think, because of our conditioning in this culture, that means that we're supposed to do more, right? How exhausting, like we're, I'm doing everything I freaking can. What do you mean? There's more. I'm supposed to do more? And one of the things I remember when Daniel, you mentioned Daniel Goodenough, our teacher, I remember when he said to me, you do know that being still and the inner listening is action. And I was like, flabbergasted. I was like... No!
Stephanie Allen:Yeah, we don't think about that do we?
Maren Oslac:I am not doing anything, I'm not doing... because I was so conditioned to be in motion in the outer world that was like, oh, sitting, being in stillness is an action. It's just it's an uncomfortable action for most of us, because we're not trained how to do it.
Stephanie Allen:I think about someone who maybe is going through a real rough time in their life. You know, a job loss or relationship loss or health loss. You know, a lot of times when someone comes to me and they have, say, a life threatening disease, and they're like, so why, you know? Why is this happening to me? I've done everything right. You know, I ate right, I exercise. And it's like it has nothing to do, it may have nothing to do with whether or not you did things right or wrong, or good or bad. It may have nothing. This may be a calling. This could be very much part of your life mission is what you are going through something that is very, there's an example of life mission. You know, sometimes it is someone's reason for being to actually go through something really challenging and hard, because what is going to change in them in order to overcome it, or or even what's going to create that ripple effect of awareness of those around them? Like, I'm not always saying that. You know, maybe you're, you've been given the unfortunate of a life threatening disease. You know, healing does not mean that you overcome that disease. Healing is who you change and how you how you go through it. This could be very much your mission, because one person does not go through something alone. Anyone you know who's gone through a real hard go, there's so many of the loved ones that are affected around that. So it can be what wakes us up or shakes us up. It's a really difficult life mission, for sure, absolutely. But your purpose then could be, hey, how am I going to go through this? What am I going to... my purpose is to let love in. My purpose is to ask for help. My purpose is to maybe change a way of thinking or being, or, you know, or just literally being in it. My purpose is to sit still and be receptive to what wants to happen. Do you see the differences between the life mission and and purpose is very, very different. And so often, you know, even wedding vows or, you know, mission statements, it's so interesting. A lot of times, in a mission statement, in a whether it's in a relationship or whether it's in a business, is really talking about purpose, not really the mission. It's different. Yeah, it's because the mission is going to supersede you, or supersede the team or super see the lifetime of something. It's beyond your ego. Yeah, and you're not actually meant to actually arrive at it. I think it's, it's you're meant to mission, you're meant to quest. It's a quest, an ongoing quest. Purpose is kind of once and done, really. It's like, yeah, my purpose is this, okay, check the box. I got it. Yep.
Maren Oslac:So I almost want you to speak more on that, because we are so... we're so(sigh) like, as a culture, we're so transactional that it's, it's the...I set my intention or my goal, and I achieve it. We're so achieved. That's the word I was looking for, achievement oriented, right? We're so achievement oriented that when you said you're not actually meant to achieve the mission, or you might not have right? Like it's not necessarily about the achievement of the mission, I could see multiple things happening for most people. A lot of people going, what the f*** does that mean? Or why bother just checking out and saying she doesn't know what the heck she's talking about. So can you talk a little bit more about what that means for you maybe?
Stephanie Allen:Hmmm, it's a great question. I think, like you said, we get so attached to the measurement of how close am I to the finish line versus what your...and then I think...
Maren Oslac:and we judge ourselves on that right, like we judge ourselves whether I've made it to the finish line or I haven't, or like I'm if I'm good enough, I've made it to the finish line, or I've gotten there faster than ... so, you know, like all of that stuff.
Stephanie Allen:Yeah, I look at it more like a relay, of like I'm meant to hand off, or I'm meant to get it started, or maybe keep it going, or maybe, you know, I don't think it's ever meant... like a spiral, a spiral relay that just keeps going, and that it does change. It does evolve. It and it's going to involve a lot more than just me. In order to do that.
Maren Oslac:I was thinking that like, that implies that there's more than just you involved. And that's one of the things that the mystics say, is that, you know, we're all connected, so, as above, so below. You know, there's so many different ways that it's said that we're all connected. We're all one being, and we're different aspects of the oneness, etc. And so getting beyond, I don't know if I love even using those words of like that next step, where that we can take, where we're inclusive, and we say, okay, if we're all in this together, then what does that look like? What's my relay? Who are, who are my people that I'm questing with in this incarnation, or in this, you know, like the everywhere, every, everywhere, what? What was that movie?
Stephanie Allen:Everything Everywhere All at Once? Yes.
Maren Oslac:So she, you know, where she visited all the different possible realities that she was in. One of the things that it made me think of was I tend to get lots of ideas. And for a while in my life, for much of my life, I thought that if I had an idea, I was supposed to do something with it. And there's the that achiever brain, right? Like I have to, I have to make that happen. And so I was running after idea after idea after idea. And again, one of my teachers had said to me, and this goes speaks to what you were just saying, of we're in it with other people. He said, often times, idea people will get ideas that aren't actually theirs to do anything with, or maybe they are going to add something to the idea, just mentally, or, you know, sketch something out, or it's not - there, there may be somebody else who's meant to take that idea and run with it. And the ideas don't live in just our brains. The ideas live in the field. There's a there's a morphogenetic field that we all tap into. And so when one person has an idea, multiple people have that idea and and I loved the concept of that I could add to that idea, and somebody else could get my addition, and it would help them with what they were creating. And it wasn't like 'Mission accomplished'. Speaking of missions, right? Purpose accomplished, maybe? In that that that achiever, we have to do everything, make everything happen. It may not happen the way that we think that it is, and we are all in it together. So how are... what's... How am I pass... I love that idea of the relay. What am I passing on to the next person? Okay, here's, here's my leg of the relay, yours, you know? And I don't know who I'm passing it off to. I just, I try, goes back to something that we've talked a lot about, of, do I live in a, you know, lik... it's Einstein's quote, the most important decision to level ever, ever make is whether you live in a friendly universe or not.
Stephanie Allen:Yeah. I mean to me, I see it as collaboration rather than competition. Sometimes, when we come from the ego place of purpose, it becomes competition, and it can be if we translate it into that you've been chosen, you have gifts and strengths and magic within you, and you've been chosen to actually, literally unfold something in this world, or become something in this world, then you can't do it alone. It requires a surrender and a listening and an actual receptivity of allowing help and love in. And that is the path that we don't often travel.
Maren Oslac:And that's the the handing the the handing the baton off, of knowing that you live in a friendly universe, because if you do live in a friendly universe, then if I hand the baton off, it's not going to come back and bite my hand where, when you live in a competitive universe, that's what you're taught. You know? I know that's one of the beliefs that I used to have. And so when I take this and bring it back to inner mastery and clarity and clarity happening on multiple levels of what is mine to do right now? Which is a purpose, and what is mine to do in the bigger scheme of things, maybe, what am I being called to do? Which is my personal mission, and when I'm clear, when the only way I well, I shouldn't say that the fastest way that I've found, because I've been studying this since I was before I was even a teenager, I got pulled into self development work and the inner work, and so having studied it for over 50 years... 40... over 40 years, I'm still not quite that old. The fastest path is this inner mastery that we're talking about, like being in the inner conversation really does change the outer world and how we experience it, not just how we experience it. Yes, it will definitely change how you experience it, and it can literally change what's happening out there.
Stephanie Allen:Yeah, and the inner listening is part of that.
Maren Oslac:And it does take a consistency of practice.
Stephanie Allen:And a group to help you kind of look inside that it's safe to hold you, you know, to be present to you, to have someone to maybe keep you accountable, or to at least ask you questions, to go deeper. Yeah, it's so helpful. We do need each other. You know, we do not meant to be. I always like that word all alone, which really means all one. It's like we're never really alone. And when we invite others in, we actually become so much more.
Maren Oslac:what you're saying is like, when you pull apart the word alone, a, l, o, n, e, you get all one. That's right. And I think that we are in a loneliness epidemic right now, that's one of the things, one of the, you know, wicked problems that is out there in the world. And so if just even that one tidbit of recognizing that we are all one, we're not alone
Stephanie Allen:exactly,
Maren Oslac:and that there is somebody who's passing a baton to you, and somebody who's looking for like, hey, you got something, let's let's play with that. I want to play in your world too. There are people out there, and I know one of the things that we would like to do is help more and more people to be in that collaborative universe and step into that place instead of the old conditioned like it's, it's, it feels so tired at this point, and it feels so forced, the competition. And so if you're looking for people with whom you can be in collaboration, reach out, because we might know somebody that, hey, they're also looking for exactly what you have. Let's do that together.
Stephanie Allen:Helping each other. That's what it's all about, isn't it?
Maren Oslac:Absolutely, absolutely. So keep an eye out for our Inner Mastery Class that we have coming up, because it may speak to you, it might be calling your name, because we will be working on practices, regular, consistent practices, and helping people to find that, and also building community. And we would love for you to be a part of it, if that's... if it speaks to you. So we will continue our Inner Mastery Series here on the podcast as well as the class that we're offering, and we'll look forward to seeing you all on the next iteration of The Soulful Leader Podcast. Thanks for joining us, and you can find us on LinkedIn and Facebook at The Soulful Leaders, and you can subscribe to our YouTube channel and see our little talking heads and get to see some snippets, and we're going to be throwing some additional stuff up there. So join us on YouTube also at The Soulful Leaders. See you soon.
Stephanie Allen:And that wraps up another episode of The Soulful Leader Podcast with your hosts, Stephanie Allen
Maren Oslac:and Maren Oslac. Thank you for listening. If you'd like to dive deeper, head over to our website, at www.TheSoulful LeaderPodcast.com
Stephanie Allen:Until next time...