The 3am Wake-Up Call

Do you ever wake up at 3 a.m. wondering what it’s all for? Thinking there must be something more?

Maybe you've checked all the boxes. 

  Career? Thriving. 

  Family? Taken care of. 

  Life on paper? Pretty great. 

So why are you waking up in the middle of the night with that gnawing feeling that something is... off?

In this episode, Stephanie and Maren get real about those middle-of-the-night moments when the big existential questions show up uninvited —Why am I here? What is this all for? Is this really it? — and what it actually means when they do.

Spoiler: nothing is wrong with you. In fact, something very right is happening.

This conversation explores the difference between outer success and inner success, why even the most accomplished people can still feel deeply empty, and how to change the narrative.

If you've ever secretly questioned what it’s all for, this episode is for you.

In This Episode

• Why waking up in the middle of the night with existential questions is actually a gift
• Three ways to work with the 3 a.m. angst
• The difference between suffering and suffering over your suffering
• Why highly successful people still feel that "fingernails on a chalkboard" emptiness
• Waking up at the end of your life, the cost of delaying finding real meaning
• A simple question to sit with this week: What would it mean to be internally successful?

Ready to stop sleepwalking and start living your life mission? Join our community at tslp.life — a growing movement of people choosing to live from the inside out.

TRANSCRIPT

YouTube Video

REFERENCES:

7:33 Ep 196 Pick Your Hard

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Transcript

Why Life Still Feels Empty

Stephanie 0:03

In a world where we have everything and it's still not enough, we're often left wondering, is this really it?

Maren 0:10

Deep inside, you know there's more to life. You're ready to leave behind the old push your way through and claim the deeper, more meaningful life that's calling you.

Stephanie 0:19

That's what we invite you to explore with us. We're your hosts, Stephanie Allen,

Maren 0:24

and Maren Oslac.

Maren and Stephanie 0:26

And this is The Soulful Leader Podcast.

Stephanie 0:30

Yay!

Maren 0:31

Do you ever find yourself waking up in the middle of the night, not able to sleep, thinking there must be more? Like the big existential questions are all in your head. When I say existential, I mean like the life questions. Why am I here? What is this all for? Why am I even doing this? You wake up and you're all...uggghhh about it. And then you finally get back to sleep, and you know, 6 a.m. happens, the alarm goes off, you hit the alarm, and you're back in execution mode, right? And you can't think about all of that deep stuff that happened in the middle of the night. You just kind of shelve it.

Stephanie 1:08

Or you wake up in the morning and you go, Oh, I'm exhausted. I didn't sleep at all last night. Because all you could do is think and worry and be concerned about what on God's earth name is this what life is about? Like there's just too much going on, and I don't feel like I'm... I've got the reins to be able to guide it. This is what we're talking about.

The Real Reason You Wake Up

Maren 1:31

Yeah.

Stephanie 1:32

And I mean, I encounter that in my own life. You know, the there's a lot, there's a lot vying for attention. My attention. There is. There's a lot. And I could be used up everywhere, basically. So how do you discern? How do you... how do you go well, what gives me meaning?

Maren 1:51

Well, so I want to start with there's a reason that you're waking up in the middle of the night. Something's trying to get your attention, right? A deeper part of you is trying to get your attention, a deep part of me is trying to get my attention. So when I hit the alarm and I go into execution mode or poor me mode, or I'm overwhelmed mode, or all the modes that we're trained into, and we're we just are like, I can't even think about that right now. Essentially, you're telling that part of yourself, you are relegated to waking me up in the middle of the night. That's the only time you're ever gonna get attention. But guess what? It's gonna keep happening.

The Devil Story About Heartbreak

Stephanie 2:36

Yeah, I know. And we tend to do so many of the other things, the outer things of like, yeah, okay, you know, I'm you know I'm gonna take melatonin or I'm gonna do magnesium, or you know, instead of like looking at what if it wasn't because you're not doing anything wrong? What if it was a wake-up call? And that the middle of the night is when it's the quiet time for you to actually hear. What if a lot of us don't have a practice at that time. And that's what it comes down to.

Maren 3:05

Yeah. I love that that you're pointing that out, right? We think there's something wrong with us and we need to fix it. So we go to the doctor and they give us a pill to fix it. Guess what?

Stephanie 3:16

So it reminds me of a story. It reminds me of a story that that this man who is a very spiritual man and very disciplined of getting up and doing his prayers every single morning, like all the time, like has never missed a beat. And you know, one day it comes and he's tired and he's sleeping, and all of a sudden he gets awoken suddenly and he looks and it's the devil. And the devil is has woken him up to do his prayers. And he's like, well, this doesn't seem right. Why would the devil wake me up to do my prayers? You think the devil would let me sleep in so that I'm not praying for peace and I'm not praying for all the you know, health and well-being. And so he asks the devil, he's like, what on earth are you doing waking me up? Like you, you of all people, yeah, I think you would have just let me sleep in and missed this. And the devil replies, saying, ha, but I know that if you missed getting up and doing your prayers, it would break your heart, and one tear would create world peace. And that is such a good teaching because for me, what it means is we think what we are doing is enough, but it's actually the pain, the suffering, the not sleeping at night, the aches and the pains, the heartbreaks, the the longing for some meaning in our life that actually is what's waking us up. And that is what helps us drop in to go to ask more questions, to go more fiercely. So many people.

Maren 4:54

Go ahead...

Stephanie 4:55

I was gonna say, so many people get to the end of their life and then they're like, that's it? You know, my life, I wanted it to mean so much more, or does it even have meaning? Like we question it. And to me that's heartbreaking because I don't... I've been with people at the end of their life and who want to hold on, who don't want to go, or they don't know where they're going. They don't have a belief system of that brings them peace, or there's things that they wish they could have, shoulda done better, like shoulda, coulda, woulda, ought to's, right? And I'm like, what would have to happen to live differently so that at the end of your life you would you would be able to just go, oh wow, what's next? This is so great. Like what would have to happen between now and then? And I think that's my existential crisis. I always think of. It's like I always think of because I've seen so many people that what would mine be? Like what would... what what is calling within me?

Pain Or Practice As A Path

Maren 6:03

So I want to, there are two things that I want to point out. One of them is when you told that story, there's a part of me I was like, oh crap. I mean, I have to be in pain? And for me, when I heard that, I was like, you know what? There is many roads to Rome. It doesn't have to be one or the other. And so, yeah, there is that moment of heartbreak that wakes us up, that that breaks us open. And we can go that path. There's the other path of continuing to do our practices or starting to do our practices to keep you know shining and and refining who we are in this lifetime so that we we start to have a conversation that's not in the middle of the night an angsty, oh my god, 'who am I'? conversation. It's a daily conversation. So that's the second thing is that there actually is a practice that you could step into literally like asking yourself a deep existential question every day, and not like I have to have an answer for this, letting it be with you. Like, what if you had a practice every morning that asked a simple question? A simple question, quote unquote.

Stephanie 7:32

Right, and you know, I'm gonna just preface the the practice, the hardness, right? We talked about 'Pick-Your-Hard' in that way.

Maren 7:46

Yeah, that's a great episode.

Stephanie 7:47

Its... we've got to get uncomfortable, and so it doesn't mean that when your heart gets broken or there's a longing or there's a need in your heart, that is very challenging. So there is an element of uncomfortability, there is an element of effort, and even when your heart does get broken on, it can be a great opportunity instead of suffering on it. I think that's what we we tend to just hold on to that suffering. And we don't have to suffer so hard. There is suffering. Suffering means to go through something, but what part of you, meaning what awareness are you taking through that suffering? Is it is the awareness that's going through that suffering something that's beating you up? Or is there awareness going through the pain and the suffering, going, oh, this is interesting? What might this be opening to? What might this be a catalyst for in the way of unfolding a gift or a strength? Because longing is not comfortable. Longing for something is not comfortable too. But it's like if we tell ourselves the itty bitty shitty committee stuff of like, oh, I suck, I'm too old, this isn't gonna work out, la la la la, I'm a victim...wha wha wha... now we're holding on to suffering and we're suffering on the suffering, right?

Maren 9:00

I was gonna say that one of our teachers always said it's like you... there quote unquote is suffering, quote unquote. And I love the fact that you brought up that suffering literally means to just to go through.

Stop Suffering Over Suffering

Maren 9:12

So, yes, we go through stuff, and it's will you go through it and come out the other side, or will you continue to suffer over your suffering?

Stephanie 9:23

Exactly!

Maren 9:24

and that's what we tend, that's what we've been trained to do in this culture. That's what we tend to do is you know, you have to feel guilty about it, you have to feel bad about it, you have to beat yourself up about it, you have to do like all the stuff.

Stephanie 9:37

And you know, it's like it's like the baby is crying. So we think of ourselves like think of the suffering or the pain or the uncomfortability as a little baby crying. Would you go in to the little baby crying and pick it up and spank it or shake it? No, you'd pick up the baby and you'd hold it and you're like, it's okay, I'm right here with you. I gotcha. And you'd might rock it or you might rub its back, or I mean, why aren't we doing that with ourselves so that we can pause in that moment of not feeling so comfortable, so that we're open to listen to what wants to come.

Maren 10:15

And I think that that's for you know, going back to when we wake up in the middle of the night and we feel that angst, instead of shoving it down or tossing and turning with it, an option is to say, I hear you, I get it, I'm with ya. You're right. What do you need? Could we have this conversation in the morning? I promise I will. And then if you promise that you will, you actually need to do it.

Stephanie 10:47

Yeah.

Maren 10:48

Because, like I said, you've trained that part of yourself to say the only time we're gonna have this discussion is in the middle of the night. That's the only time I'm gonna give you attention. So it's gonna wake you up in the middle of the night. If you negotiate with it and treat it with kindness and respect and say, I hear you, then you actually need to, just like a person who called you in the middle of the night and they're like, hey, I need something. You're like, I am dead asleep. Could we talk in the morning? And the person's like, yeah, we could. If you ignored that person, it's gonna be a problem eventually. So you actually need to give that part of you the attention and say, okay, you know what? You called me in the middle of the night. What's up?

Stephanie 11:36

And sometimes that's a great, that's a great option. And another option might be just lie there and breathe. Just listen. There's a reason you're up, and it's not a bad one. It's the quietest time of your of your day. It gives you a chance to tune in to what's going on within you, to face what is needing, needs, and to be able to really be with it, like to rock the baby. I mean, how many times do little babies wake up in the middle of the night? And that to know that there's someone there for them, to rest in that, I think, you know, there's another possibility that, like, and this is what I do anyway, is like if I wake up, instead of getting anxious about waking up in the middle of the night and now I'm gonna be tired for tomorrow because that's sometimes I go there too. I would go, you know, I remember to tell myself, I'm like, wait a minute, you're up, because maybe the angel has tapped me on my shoulder and it has something to share

Moments of Inspiration

Stephanie 12:37

with me. Maybe there's something to listen to, a guidance, an aha. I mean, it's just the other night I had so many aha's in the middle. I didn't sleep, but I wasn't exhausted. I was a little tired, but I wasn't exhausted as much as I thought I should be because I was getting so many insights creatively. And those can be some of the greatest moments of inspiration if we know how to listen.

Maren 13:05

And one of the things I want to, I guess I'll ask you, when you say creatively, are you talking about like you got the creative idea to like, oh my gosh, I need to get up and paint a picture or do something different? Is it an outer world or is it an inner world creativity?

Stephanie 13:24

Uh it could be anything, really. It could be anything. It's just, I don't know. It could be anything. I'm just open. And often it it has a lot to do with maybe there's been a question in my heart for the last little while, and I'm lying there. And if I don't try to force it to come, which is what I do a lot, if I practice of like just letting it be and being present to it, it's amazing what like my dreams or insights, or maybe it's guidance that comes to me. I don't know. It has a lot to do with the question that I might be living.

Maren 14:02

So the thing I'm hearing is space. We need to give it space. And right now, I think we've been so conditioned that we need our sleep and we need to execute, and we need to do all of these things that we push through the parts of ourselves that are trying to get our attention. So, what would it look like in your life? And everyone's gonna be different. Like, we've given you two different options here of sit with it in the middle of the night, or say, negotiate it with it and say, I hear you, and I'll talk to you tomorrow. You know, like, and it might be different each night, right? So, what would it mean in your life to give that piece of yourself that's knocking on your door? It's there be for a reason to give it some space, to tell it, I hear you, and I'm listening. What do you want to tell me? And then be present to it.

Should You Negotiate?

Stephanie 15:15

And that does take practice and practice and patience and patience and also guidance in the way of it's helpful to have people in your life who can be present to you with you know and hold you in a very high regard in the way it's like they believe in in who you are and what you're meant to become, until you can believe in who you are and what you're meant to become. Like they can hold it, not pressure you, but just accept that actually there's a great being inside all of us, and to really practice seeing that both in yourself as in uh as in others as well. It's just it's an interesting thing. So having a practice, having you know, individuals around you that will hold you, and having a belief that there is, you are amazing. You there is a meaning and a purpose and a value and a worth that is locked in the treasure of your chest. It's in there.

Maren 16:09

And I want to say that there is a path to it, and this is what we work with. So of course I'm going to say that. And I find that traditional psychology, traditional methods of you know, like moving through, moving us through to success. Like I find that psychology is there to help us to get to our success, to digest all of the the issues so that we can be successful. And success and meaning are not the same thing.

Stephanie 16:44

Say more to that.

Maren 16:46

So there are a lot of highly successful people who are feeling that same angst that you know, it's like we assume that when we get to that place of like, I made it, that we don't wake up in the middle of the night with that angst going on, and it's just not true. Because success and meaning are two different things, and they come from different places in us. Success is this mental, high rational, have to do it, cognitive, we've been trained. And meaning comes from our soul.

Making Space

Stephanie 18:05

I look at success on two levels. There's the outer manifestation of success on what the world sees, and then there's the internal manifestation of success, which is what only I see. And that's between me and my heart. And I what I'm hearing you say is that I feel like there's a lot of people in this world that have outer success, but internally they don't feel successful. There's something that's off, there's something that's not giving them nourishment or satisfaction. There's... it's like you know, fingernails on a chalkboard kind of thing. There's something that's off. And we can say, yeah, my life's really good, you know. I've checked all the boxes, I've got all the things, I've, you know, got all the awards, I make a difference, I volunteer, all these check boxes. But so why do I feel so empty? Why do I feel so much lack of peace or angst? And that's the inner success that nobody talks about.

Maren 18:25

Yeah.

Stephanie 18:26

Because it feels like we're ashamed because how dare you be so ungrateful. You have all these things going on in your life, and you're still not happy? You have no right. I mean, that's what we say to ourselves and to each other. But that's where the balance feels off. And so, how do we bring that internal? And that's another whole level that the mind is not... I always say the mind is the driver of the bus, meaning our bus is our body and the mind is the driver. And the spirit, though, the soul, so much bigger than all of that.

Success Versus Meaning

Maren 19:29

Well, that's what's ideally, that's what's telling us where the bus is going. And because it's the map, right? And because we haven't connected to that, we come in and we get trained right away to do what the outer world tells us to do. That "here's what success looks like". So we get caught in that what you said, like the outer loop of okay, now I've done all the outer things, and many of them are very meaningful. And for me, the distinguish, I guess, like you said, success has two levels. For me, meaning also has two levels. There's the outer meaning of, yeah, I'm doing things that are meaningful, that I was told they're meaningful and that are good and all of that stuff. Yet that's why I said for me, meaning, the deeper meaning comes from my soul. Like, what's my agreement that I said I was gonna come to this planet at this time and do this thing? And you know, you might be listening, going, hmm, there is such a thing. We made agreements to come here and do something. Yeah, I believe that we really did. And that's why there's the emptiness when when we don't fulfill that, that part of us is gonna keep tapping from the inside out, going tap, tap, tap, tap, tap. Hey, wake up. We came here for a reason. There's more to do, and not in a more to do, like I'm exhausted, don't tell me there's more to do type of way. In a oh my god, that's what my heart has been longing for kind of way.

Stephanie 20:45

Yeah, I there's so much possibilities and treasure inside of us, and so few of us get a chance to ever look in. And often that's what I see on people on their deathbed is that they like, I looked outside for love, I looked outside for success, I looked outside for wealth, I looked outside for health and happiness, and I never looked inward, and now it's too late. That's tends to be where they're getting, and it's like, and I think there's also a realization at that moment of death of like, oh my gosh, it's so amazing. How did I how did I not look inside of this for so long? Why was I so scared?

Maren 21:30

You know, the veils are thinner. So the mystics say that there's 10,000 veils between us and the one who sent us, and that the quote unquote one who sent us would be a part of ourselves, right, that sent us here. And as we get closer to our death, those veils get thinner and we get clearer. And the good news is that we don't have to wait, we can do that now, and that's the process that we're talking. Talking about those existential questions, the reason you're being awakened in the middle of the night is because that part of you, that deeper part of you, wants to have that conversation with you now and not wait.

Inner Success And Life Mission

Stephanie 22:13

So, what if from moving forward and you are starting to look at your outer world and the success? Just hold the question what would it be like to be internally successful? What even would that mean for you, for those who are listening? What does it mean to be successful inwardly? Like with how you feel about yourself, about your gifts, your strengths, your whatever, whatever it is. And if you wake up in the middle of the night, what if you just held that question and know that the angel of life mission is tapping you on the shoulder and not get anxious about it, but just say, okay, I'm listening. Give it to me in a dream, or give it to me in guidance or an insight or wonder. And just play with it. Play with it. And if you need help, ask.

Join The Community And Next Steps

Maren 23:06

Reach out, reach out to us, join our community because that's what we're doing as a community. We're actually asking those questions. And there's a large group of people. It's creating a movement of let's live our life mission instead of what people are telling us to live. Let's live from our souls. And we would love to have you be a part of our community. So reach out to us. You can find us on our website, www.tslp.life, or on social media on LinkedIn and Facebook and YouTube at The Soulful Leaders. That's we look forward to... yeah, we look forward to having more of these conversations with you. See you in two weeks.

Stephanie 23:46

See you. And that wraps up another episode of The Soulful Leader Podcast, with your hosts Stephaine Allen...

Maren 24:03

....and Maren Oslac. Thank you for listening. If you'd like to dive deeper, head over to our website at the www.TheSoulful Leader Podcast.com.

Stephanie 24:12

Until next time!